Discussion about 09/11/2001: [911TruthAction] Digest Number 1135

Saturday, February 18, 2006

[911TruthAction] Digest Number 1135

There are 12 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Re: New rule to stop the disruptors?
From: Kevin Hammond <sir_oglaigh@yahoo.com>
2. Wing TV 2/20 NYC promo
From: "Greg Nixon" <nxngrg@yahoo.com>
3. HMmmmm! Douglas Clark
From: "Lowell Byrd" <cbyrdman@yahoo.com>
4. Re: HMmmmm! Douglas Clark
From: Naveed <flanker12k@yahoo.com>
5. RE: New rule to stop the disruptors?
From: "Scott Peden" <scotpeden@cruzio.com>
6. Revised with new link for Wing TV if you can't get the original to load
From: "Marsha" <Mofmars3@wmconnect.com>
7. RE: New rule to stop the disruptors?
From: John Perna <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
8. Federal tactics for Information Warfare
From: "savefreedom2005" <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
9. Totalitarians use misfits to disrupt free speech on the internet.
From: "savefreedom2005" <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
10. GARGER: Katrina & 9/11 Demand Impeachment - SF Bay View
From: Cathy Garger <savorsuccesslady@yahoo.com>
11. Re: Bloggers in Amsterdam
From: Cathy Garger <savorsuccesslady@yahoo.com>
12. re: Kick ass on Monday!
From: JKMarion@aol.com

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 19:56:45 -0800 (PST)
From: Kevin Hammond <sir_oglaigh@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: New rule to stop the disruptors?

Larry, personally, I did not have a problem with some of what you have posted, and some of my research follows similar lines as yours. But the MAIN purpose of this group is to discuss strategies to dissemenate {SPELLING}? the truth of what happened on that horrific day. Activism strategy. One of the only problems that I have with your posts is that they seem to go on and on. Otherwise I am a major proponant of REAL free speech. All the time that is spent constantly denouncing others detracts from actual activism. And newcomers take a look at this stuff and think we are ALL a bunch of nuts! Itis a bit confusing to newbies. I myself am guilty of partaking in a pissing contest which is something that I absolutely abhor ad told myself that I would NEVER DO. It is counterproductive.

Kevin.

hitech_01_47460 <hitech_01_47460@yahoo.com> wrote:
OK then Alan, may I be allowed back in this group if I follow these
rules also???

I mean I think I shared some compelling EVIDENCE as to who is
furnishing DISINFORMATION and who isn't.

If you want to be FAIR, I should be allowed to 'debate' with FACTS
AND EVIDENCE others can see.

Unless you really BELIEVE in those 'arab hijackers' whom many were
found ALIVE in Saudi Arabia. etc.

I again encourage email with any questions you have to
hitech2@bluemarble.net bluemarble.net

Or you can phone me.

My goal since 2000 in Yahoo groups has been to share information
freely, though I have battled with
DISINFORMERS making like claims over that time.

If I'm right, (AND I'M ENCOURAGING VERIFICATION OF WHAT I SAY HERE)
then shouldn't I be ALLOWED to participate?

Larry Lawson (NOT Tim White)

And NO I work on the behalf of NO FEDeral agency or FOREIGN
government like Israel.

--- In 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com, alan random <alanrandom@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> As you've all noticed, there have been a lot of divisive posts
lately with people attacking others as Cointelpro, etc. And this can
be very depressing and distracting. That's what they want. So don't
let it get to you. Don't let them ruin this very important group. We
can figure out a way to fix this problem.
> Here's my suggestion:
> NEW RULE. If you want to post something accusing another list
member of being a spy or disruptor, you must first send it OFF-LIST
to the moderators for approval. If you send it to the entire group,
you will be warned. If you do it again, you will be removed.
>
> In general, I've always said that I think it's a bad idea to
launch spy/disruptor accusations on the list. Because then it just
leads to more accusations and more disruption. The best way to handle
someone you suspect is a disruptor is to a) ignore them, or b)
express your disagreement with their arguments in a polite,
respectful manner. I think if we can all agree to do this, we can
keep the real disruptors from achieving their goal, which is to
destroy the morale of this group.
>
> Any further suggestions are appreciated.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Brings words and photos together (easily) with
> PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail.
>

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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 04:01:39 -0000
From: "Greg Nixon" <nxngrg@yahoo.com>
Subject: Wing TV 2/20 NYC promo

http://thewebfairy.com/hardtruth/gregnixon02-20.mp3

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 04:32:11 -0000
From: "Lowell Byrd" <cbyrdman@yahoo.com>
Subject: HMmmmm! Douglas Clark

Doug (may I call you Doug?), if I had the knowledge you say you have,
without a doubt, a hundred dollars ain't shit. I could beg, borrow, or
pawn to get that measely amount. With your said knowledge, you
shouldn't have any problem at all.
NO! I do not intend to fall for your scheme.
sorry'boutthat!

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 4
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 21:07:31 -0800 (PST)
From: Naveed <flanker12k@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: HMmmmm! Douglas Clark

cool your jets.......

or have them cooled for you....

Lowell Byrd <cbyrdman@yahoo.com> wrote:
Doug (may I call you Doug?), if I had the knowledge you say you have,
without a doubt, a hundred dollars ain't shit. I could beg, borrow, or
pawn to get that measely amount. With your said knowledge, you
shouldn't have any problem at all.
NO! I do not intend to fall for your scheme.
sorry'boutthat!

---------------------------------

In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.
- Notebook, 1904

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing, reviews, & more on new and used cars.

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Message: 5
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 00:19:50 -0800
From: "Scott Peden" <scotpeden@cruzio.com>
Subject: RE: New rule to stop the disruptors?

Accusing someone of being a mole/troll/cointelpro/spy, definitely is a
pointed personal derogatory remark (unless the rare person out there just
loves the label).

-----Original Message-----
From: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of alan random
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 3:28 PM
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [911TruthAction] New rule to stop the disruptors?

OK, how about this?:
From now on, let's consider all spy/cointelpro accusations of list members
as a form of flaming. Under this rule, you can still accuse people not in
this group of being disinfo agents (although this too, is a very annoying
distraction), but if one accuses a fellow 911truthaction group member of
being an agent/spy, they will be warned once. If they do it again, they will
be removed.

For those on this list who are currently engaged in spy-accusation battles,
you are free to continue your threads, but from here on out you must debate
only the issues and refrain from further personal attacks or accusations.

If anyone disagrees with this policy suggestion, let me know. If no one
disagrees, I think it should be made effective immediately.

Scott Peden <scotpeden@cruzio.com> wrote:
I think this will help.

Personally I like the no flaming rule. It works like this;
!

A flame is a derogatory remark, pointedly personal at a group member. Issues
are OK for flame the hell out of, people on the group, no way.

In one of my larger groups we have found ! that what drives people off
fast, are Flame wars, Spam, and the same article being posted repeatedly.
Flame wars cost a group of 600 members about 3 members a day for at least 3
days after then flaming has stopped. That is, one day of flame wars can cost
10 members.

You can’t get the word out if the group members are now looking at the
negative side of being in the group.

If you want the cointel disinformation subversives agents here on this list,
as it has appeared to me, then post it on the home page so the new members
know what is up and that they have to figure this out fro themselves.

Stick to the groups purpose, rules only facilitate achieving your purpose.

Hi everyone,

As you've all noticed, there have been a lot of divisive posts lately with
people attacking others as Cointelpro, etc. And this can be very depressing
and distracting. That's what they want. So don't let it get to you. Don't
let them ruin this very important group. W! e can figure out a way to fix
this problem.
Here's my suggestion:
NEW RULE. If you want to post something accusing another list member of
being a spy or disruptor, you must first send it OFF-LIST to the moderators
for approval. If you send it to the entire group, you will be warned. If you
do it again, you will be removed.

In general, I've always said that I think it's a bad idea to launch
spy/disruptor accusations on the list. Because then it just leads to more
accusations and more disruption. The best way to handle someone you suspect
is a disruptor is to a) ignore them, or b) express your disagreement with t!
heir arguments in a polite, respectful manner. I think if we can all agree
to do this, we can keep the real disruptors from achieving their goal, which
is to destroy the morale of this group.

Any further suggestions are appreciated.
_____

Brin! gs words and photos together (easily) with
PhotoMail
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/PMall/*http://photomail.mail.yahoo.
com> - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail.

_____

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wNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDMmF1dG9z/*http://autos.yahoo.com/newcars/popular/thisweek
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United state patent search
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Message: 6
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 09:08:09 -0000
From: "Marsha" <Mofmars3@wmconnect.com>
Subject: Revised with new link for Wing TV if you can't get the original to load

Press Release "War Crimes" and "Media Cover-Up of 9/11" Forward Widely

Presidents' Day "March for 9/11 Truth," NYC Ground Zero, 10 a.m.
Monday, 2/20/06

Activists Plan 60's Style Protest against "War Crimes" and "Media
Cover-Up of 9/11" in downtown Manhattan

New York City, NY (PRWEB) February 18, 2006 -- Vermonter Greg Nixon
is a man on a mission to save America - from itself. He is one of a
new breed of issue-oriented activists who were often not even
involved in politics before 9/11. What mobilizes him is a prospect of
indescribable horror: he sees plain proof that the WTC was destroyed
on 9/11 in an undercover operation within America's own military
intelligence establishment.

From all angles, it's a topsy-turvy world view, that can bowl one
over with vertigo at first. A mirror world with such contrarian
coordinates as:
- the terrorists are Americans, not Arabs;
- ex-mayor Giuliani and George Bush are suspects, not heroes of 9/11;
- much as the Bush administration capitalized on 9/11 to advance its
agenda, the 9/11 Truthers seize on it as the Achilles heel of
the "new militarism," with evidence of a controlled demolition of WTC
1, 2 and 7 as the smoking gun or fatal flaw in the official version;
- "left-leaning" media like The Nation, Pacifica's Democracy Now, and
The New York Times, along with groups like ANSWER and the Democratic
Party, are not seen as a real opposition; because they don't
accept "9/11 Truth," they are just playing a part in the plans for
World War IV on the oil fields of the Middle East.

Indeed, Greg Nixon would like the President's Day March to take aim
especially at the "establishment left gatekeepers."

The plan for Monday's march is fairly ad hoc. After assembling at WTC
Ground Zero, the protesters may march to Attorney General Elliot
Spitzer's office with a letter demanding his resignation for failing
to investigate 9/11. Last year, 9/11 activists in New York filed an
extensive complaint with Spitzer, and hopes were high for a time that
he might take up the case. Offices of the above-mentioned "left-wing
gatekeepers" could be next.

Speakers expected are Greg Nixon and others, including:
Craig Hill, the Vermont Green Party senatorial candidate, who
includes photographic evidence of the WTC demolition in his campaign
platform. His website is www.hillsenatenow.org .
Sander Hicks, author of the 9/11 expos? The Big Wedding, and owner of
the Vox Pop Democracy Caf? in Brooklyn, www.voxpopnet.net.

9/11 activist, historian and radio personality Webster Tarpley will
speak at a Greg Nixon event on April 27th at the University of
Vermont. Tarpley is devoting his energies to opposing the latest war
drive on Iran. He says the plan is to attack Iran already by the end
of March, which leaves much less time for mobilizing springtime
demonstrations such as we saw before the attack on Iraq. (see
http://www.waronfreedom.org/activists/stop-amerigeddon.html) He is
the author of 9/11 Synthetic Terror: Made in USA.

During the run-up to the Iraq war, 9/11 activists tried but failed to
convince the peace movement that exposing 9/11 was the only way to
stop the juggernaut of war. They felt that rank-and-file pacifists
were receptive, but the leadership marched to a different,
establishment tune.

More details on the Presidents' Day march at
http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2006/01/332307.shtml .

See also the feature article on the march at
http://dc.indymedia.org/newswire/display/132464/index.php "2/20 March
for 9/11 Truth NYC: The Tipping Point? The world is at the most
serious crossroads in modern history. The fraudulent 'War on Terror'
threatens the very future of humanity."

For an interview with Greg Nixon, see
http://www.phillyimc.org/en/2006/02/19016.shtml . Quote:
"Bring your digital camera, too. Because something tells me that
history is going to be made in New York City this upcoming Monday, in
honor of President?s Day. That?s the day those actually informed
about 9/11 will gather together in NYC to honor the birthday of the
first GW. You know, the GW who was unable to tell a lie."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Today>>>Friday>>>wingtv.net...All media and people everywhere must
see this interview with Greg Nixon

If you can't get the show to play...Left click where it says to right
click and watch later

Alternate link>>>http://thewebfairy.com/hardtruth/gregnixon02-20.mp3

Marsha McClelland
Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio
XXX XXX-XXXX

"We The People United Movement"
We are many Political and Patriot Groups joining together, to help
right the wrongs in America..."United We Will Stand"

WETHEPEOPLE_UNITED
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WETHEPEOPLE_UNITED/

Join your fellow Patriots and Unite for Action:

TheRevolutionaryCoalition
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheRevolutionaryCoalition/

WeThePeopleCoalition
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WeThePeopleCoalition/

Click here: 911TruthAction
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/911TruthAction/

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Message: 7
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 02:53:15 -0800 (PST)
From: John Perna <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: New rule to stop the disruptors?

Check the archives.
My posts were general information
and comments about disinformers;
which mentioned no names.

My posts often stated this:
"This does not mention anyone's name.
If there is anyone who thinks that this description accurately
applies to himself,
that person is invited to comment."

I mentioned Disinformers, WITHOUT MENTIONING ANYONE'S NAME,
and there was one member who took offense, and popped in to comment.
I did not mention anyone's name,
but apparently someone insisted, and still insists, that this was about them.

It is safe to conclude that if one were to throw a rock into a pen full of
pigs,
and one of them squealed,
that the one that squealed,
would be the one that you had hit.
Who is it that says that this "shoe fits"?
It is a good dog, who knows his name,
and comes when he is called.

It makes perfect sense to ban the person WHO ACTUALLY IS
making personal attacks BY NAME.

It makes NO sense AT ALL to ban the person WHO IS NOT
making personal attacks, BUT who just
"hit the nail on the head" so well that the disinformer
identified himself by taking it personally.

Scott Peden <scotpeden@cruzio.com> wrote:

v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} Accusing someone of being a mole/troll/cointelpro/spy, definitely is a pointed personal derogatory remark (unless the rare person out there just loves the label).

-----Original Message-----
From: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com [mailto:911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of alan random
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 3:28 PM
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [911TruthAction] New rule to stop the disruptors?

OK, how about this?:
From now on, let's consider all spy/cointelpro accusations of list members as a form of flaming. Under this rule, you can still accuse people not in this group of being disinfo agents (although this too, is a very annoying distraction), but if one accuses a fellow 911truthaction group member of being an agent/spy, they will be warned once. If they do it again, they will be removed.

For those on this list who are currently engaged in spy-accusation battles, you are free to continue your threads, but from here on out you must debate only the issues and refrain from further personal attacks or accusations.

If anyone disagrees with this policy suggestion, let me know. If no one disagrees, I think it should be made effective immediately.

Scott Peden <scotpeden@cruzio.com> wrote:
I think this will help.

Personally I like the no flaming rule. It works like this;
!

A flame is a derogatory remark, pointedly personal at a group member. Issues are OK for flame the hell out of, people on the group, no way.

In one of my larger groups we have found ! that what drives people off fast, are Flame wars, Spam, and the same article being posted repeatedly. Flame wars cost a group of 600 members about 3 members a day for at least 3 days after then flaming has stopped. That is, one day of flame wars can cost 10 members.

You can’t get the word out if the group members are now looking at the negative side of being in the group.

If you want the cointel disinformation subversives agents here on this list, as it has appeared to me, then post it on the home page so the new members know what is up and that they have to figure this out fro themselves.

Stick to the groups purpose, rules only facilitate achieving your purpose.

-----Original Message-----
From: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com [mailto:911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of alan random
Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2006 2:13 PM
To: 911truthaction@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [911TruthAction] New rule to stop the disruptors?

Hi everyone,

As you've all noticed, there have been a lot of divisive posts lately with people attacking others as Cointelpro, etc. And this can be very depressing and distracting. That's what they want. So don't let it get to you. Don't let them ruin this very important group. W! e can figure out a way to fix this problem.
Here's my suggestion:
NEW RULE. If you want to post something accusing another list member of being a spy or disruptor, you must first send it OFF-LIST to the moderators for approval. If you send it to the entire group, you will be warned. If you do it again, you will be removed.

In general, I've always said that I think it's a bad idea to launch spy/disruptor accusations on the list. Because then it just leads to more accusations and more disruption. The best way to handle someone you suspect is a disruptor is to a) ignore them, or b) express your disagreement with t! heir arguments in a polite, respectful manner. I think if we can all agree to do this, we can keep the real disruptors from achieving their goal, which is to destroy the morale of this group.

Any further suggestions are appreciated.

---------------------------------

Brin! gs words and photos together (easily) with
PhotoMail - it's free and works with Yahoo! Mail.

---------------------------------

What are the most popular cars? Find out at Yahoo! Autos

---------------------------------

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail
Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.

[This message contained attachments]

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 8
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 10:57:21 -0000
From: "savefreedom2005" <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: Federal tactics for Information Warfare

Invasive Federal tactics for Information Warfare on the Internet
(only a fed disinformer could object to this post. Let's see who
squeals)

It is very simple:
We learn who the most effective human rights activists are,
by seeing who the government shills attack.
We learn who the government shills are,
by seeing who attacks the most effective human rights activists.

http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~alb/misc/infowarDistraction.html

Information Warfare on the Internet
[I posted this to alt.mindcontrol in early December, 1997. The
group had been flooded with posts for sex-related web sites, and
included graphic jpeg images. While this post is mostly about Usenet
news groups, much of it applies to email and web sites too. The term
information warfare is, in many respects, just a new word for what
used to be called propaganda.]

The recent porn posts in alt.mindcontrol fit in as one of a variety
of techniques for disrupting internet news groups. If you read about
the basic cointelpro techniques, most such disruptions are
variations on those themes. They are also deniable, and this
uncertainty is cultivated and prized by harassers because it can
lead to (justified) paranoia and false accusations that discredit
the victim.

Information techniques
Distraction with irrelevant posts. What better example than the
recent porn posts? Discussion is lost in the noise. (In this case,
the posts may make the group "appealing" to a new audience, so a
small silver lining is that new people can be informed about mind
control.)
Distraction by voluminous postings with no information by blowhards
and empty name-callers. (Can be hard to distinguish from genuine
blowhards.) People who wallow in the mud do not need to outdebate
you; they only need to drag you down there with them. Kill files can
help if your newsreader has them.
Planting of provocateurs (and sleeper agents, etc.). These people
will vary from the posters who suddenly show up one day under an
alias attacking regular posters, to people who seem like regular
posters themselves. They may work in teams, supporting each other
and giving the illusion of popular support on the net. (Remember,
net IDs are basically free, and one person can have many.) As
cointelpro showed, there is little that is more poisonous to an
organization than to have it tear itself apart from the inside with
accusations of moles. (The CIA knows all about this from its own
mole hunts.) Moles love to accuse others of being moles; then again,
there are real moles. You have to judge for yourself who to listen
to or what to believe.
Hardware techniques
Spoofing. Forgeries and modified content. Does not need to be global
over the whole internet, for example just your local news server can
be modified. If they control your regular communication line like
your phone line there is no end to the illusions that can be
created. There is a danger that some forms of spoofing will be
detected, though, and it is harder to do, so I think these
techniques are used less widely than the others.
Canceling posts. Posts disappear or only propagate in a limited
region. This has deniability as just network problems, since
sometimes there really are network problems. One technique is to
secretly "localize" posts that are not approved by some censor or
gatekeeper. Most people will not notice if their post only appears
on their local news server, and will assume it has propagated
worldwide. They will just think no one has replied (though spoof
replies can be posted locally, too). I check to see that my posts
show up at DejaNews. Hardly foolproof, but at least then I know
people can read them there (at least until more sophisticated
spoofing is available, perhaps tailored to domain names or user
names).
Delaying posts. By controlling when posts show up, the flow of the
debate can be controlled. A heads-up warning can be given to the
plants on the group to counter arguments ahead of time. They can
also make the same arguments or statements themselves ahead of time
to build their own "credibility" or to steal thunder.
Controlling search engines. If no one can find it, it is not there.
I do not have any evidence that this has happened. The real danger
is the possibility of "voluntary" self-censorship like we have seen,
for example, in the newspapers with regard to radiation experiments.
Combined hardware/information techniques
Feedback pathways. An important aspect of psychological warfare is
to have a feedback path to the victim. (This is like a control
signal in dynamical systems theory.) The feedback path may be used
covertly to manipulate the victim, the victim may become aware of it
on his or her own, or the victim may be purposely made aware of it.
Harassers often want victims think their harassers have control over
them. To know they are being watched. This can help induce
psychological trauma and regression in the victim. [According to the
KUBARK interrogation manual, "All coercive techniques are designed
to induce regression."] A feedback path can alert the victim that he
is being manipulated. This can be done by telephones ringing or fax
machines. It can be done with sophisticated mind control methods. It
could even be done in newspapers if some person or agency knew the
newspapers the victim reads and could influence their content (e.g.
the final cointelpro link below).

But the internet is a fairly new medium that fits this bill
perfectly if the subject reads newsgroups. In a simple example, you
cancel a person's post and then post your own article hinting that
you have done it. (Incidentally, psychological torturers can pretend
to have caused anything they are aware of having happened.) The
person gets angry, but they may not be sure, and if they accuse the
tormentor they are ridiculed. (Always try to goad the victims into
doing things in public that will discredit them.)

When the hardware is expanded to include home surveillance and mind
control techniques, the effects can be magnified immensely.

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Can anyone truly doubt that these techniques have been extensively
studied and documented by our government? The stonewall of denial
fights for every inch of ground, no matter how trivial. People will
still deny obvious, documented (cointelpro) things like this to
delay having to deny the next step of the chain ("Yes, maybe they
studied it but they would never test it on Americans [they did], and
they surely are not still doing it today [they are].")

Secret agencies are still arms of the federal government.

cointelpro:

http://mediafilter.org/MFF/USDCO.idx.html
http://dickshovel.netgate.net/coin.html
http://www.webcom.com/~pinknoiz/covert/cointelpro.html

and at the last site, especially

http://www.webcom.com/~pinknoiz/covert/seberg.html

If a simple request for evidence gives rise to a vitriolic personal
attack,
or an attempt to censor, rather than the addressing of the issue,
then one can only assume that the attacker has no other way to
respond.
Any time that a simple request for evidence gives rise to a
vitriolic personal attack,
you can be assured that you are dealing with a hoax.

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Message: 9
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 11:07:29 -0000
From: "savefreedom2005" <savefreedom2005@yahoo.com>
Subject: Totalitarians use misfits to disrupt free speech on the internet.

Totalitarians use misfits to disrupt free speech on the internet.
This procedure will destroy the totalitarian's most effective
method of disrupting free speech on the internet.
Trolls; who have seen this procedure work before,
will generally leave as soon as this message is posted.
Please pass this around.
Permission to add this to web pages is granted.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FreedomOfSpeechNow/message/25

What is a Troll?

An Internet "troll" is a person who delights in
sowing discord on the Internet.
He tries to start arguments, and upsets people.

Trolls see internet communications as
convenient venues for their bizarre game.
They are actually afflicted with a form a sadism;
in that, they take joy in hurting people.
A sadist gets sexual pleasure from causing pain.
Quite simply; a troll is a sadist,
who is engaging in the sadist's version of "cyber sex".
Many trolls are bigots.
Bigotry is a good cover for sadism.

Trolls feel no sorrow whatsoever for the pain they inflict.
Indeed, the greater the suffering they cause;
the greater their joy.
For the moment, the relative anonymity of the net allows
trolls to flourish.

Trolls are utterly impervious to criticism
(constructive or otherwise).

Arguing with a troll is like playing Russian roulette with a dead
man.

The troll's usual reaction to a response will be amazingly similar
to the adolescent phrase:

"I know you are, but what am I?"

When the trolls become very desperate, they will resort to insulting
the normal member; by name, AND IN THE SUBJECT LINE, OF THE MESSAGE.

Trolls are quite predictable.
Within a few hours of the first time,
that that this message was posted ,
one of the internet's most active trolls posted a message,
with my name in the subject line,
saying that I am the ultimate troll.

After this message was first posted,
many people asked if there was a web page;
which gave a list of known trolls.
If you want the trolls to identify themselves,
just post this message,
and see who takes offence,
and pops in to comment.

It is safe to conclude that if one were to throw a rock into a pen
full of
pigs,
and one of them squealed,
that the one that squealed,
would be the one that you had hit.

You cannot negotiate with trolls.
You cannot cause trolls to feel shame or compassion.
You cannot reason with trolls.
Trolls cannot be made to feel remorse.
You can say:
"Why don't you take your silly bickering to the chat room,
and stop filling up everyone's mail box with drivel?"
BUT THEY NEVER WILL.
The reason that the trolls refuse to take their silly bickering
to the chat room is that then everyone would see how few people are
interested in what they have to say,
by the fact that NO ONE would go with them to the chat room.
NO ONE, BUT THE TROLLS, WOULD BE THERE!
ALSO; then they would not be filling up everyone's mail box,
with drivel;
which is their real goal.

Trolls do not feel they are bound by the
rules of courtesy or social responsibility.

Perhaps this sounds inconceivable. You may think,
"Surely there is something I can write that will change them."
But a true troll can not be changed by mere words.

The only way to deal with trolls is to limit your
reaction to reminding others not to respond to trolls.

When you try to reason with a troll, he wins.
When you insult a troll, he wins.
When you scream at a troll, he wins.
The only thing that trolls cannot handle is being ignored.

Taking out the trash

There is a scenario;
which repeats itself continuously on the internet egroups.

A group; which was originally formed for a specific purpose,
loses it moderator, and is taken over by trolls.
The trolls bully the normal members,
and drive many of them out,
with insults and personal attacks.
You could put the troll into your "blocked sender" list,
but then you would not know what he is saying about you.
If the normal members leave then they have turned the list OVER to
the trolls.

There is a simple solution:
The list decides on one "Designated Driver for the garbage truck".
The "garbage truck" is for
hauling away the trash, from list trolls.

All but ONE member, of the list, puts the troll into their "blocked
sender" list.
The "Designated Driver" for the garbage truck
reads the troll's garbage,
and notifies the list, or notifies any individual members PRIVATELY,
of anything that might interest them.
Then the rest of the list can operate at peace.
No one is worried about what the troll in writing about them,
AFTER they put him into the blocked sender list..
No one EVER responds to the troll's message.
If you think that someone might have read the troll's insults and
slander,
then just make a general post, that does not mention the troll,
but addresses his slander.
This should NEVER be posted as a reply.
Replying TO THE TROLL will cause those who have put him into their
blocked sender list,
to have to see his message.

OF COURSE, the list trolls can create new ID's,
that are not blocked, as long as they like,
but that is fine.
It only takes one click,
with the mouse,
to put the new ID in "blocked sender" also.
The troll will get ONE POST PER ID.
IF YOU REPORT THE TROLL, eventually he will lose each of those ID's.

Trolls are a way of destroying freedom of speech.
Read up on the invasive tactics for Information Warfare on the
Internet

visit:

http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~alb/misc/infowarDistraction.html

excerpt:
Information techniques
Distraction with irrelevant posts. What better example than the
recent porn posts? Discussion is lost in the noise. (In this case,
the posts may make the group "appealing" to a new audience, so a
small silver lining is that new people can be informed about mind
control.)
Distraction by voluminous postings with no information by blowhards
and empty name-callers. (Can be hard to distinguish from genuine
blowhards.) People who wallow in the mud do not need to outdebate
you; they only need to drag you down there with them. Kill files can
help if your newsreader has them.
Planting of provocateurs (and sleeper agents, etc.). These people
will vary from the posters who suddenly show up one day under an
alias attacking regular posters, to people who seem like regular
posters themselves. They may work in teams, supporting each other
and giving the illusion of popular support on the net. (Remember,
net IDs are basically free, and one person can have many.) As
cointelpro showed, there is little that is more poisonous to an
organization than to have it tear itself apart from the inside with
accusations of moles. (The CIA knows all about this from its own
mole hunts.) Moles love to accuse others of being moles; then again,
there are real moles. You have to judge for yourself who to listen
to or what to believe.
The reader will notice that no one is named in this discussion.
If there is any person; who feels that this discussion accurately
describes themselves,
that person is invited to comment.

________________________________________________________________________
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Message: 10
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 05:49:33 -0800 (PST)
From: Cathy Garger <savorsuccesslady@yahoo.com>
Subject: GARGER: Katrina & 9/11 Demand Impeachment - SF Bay View

REQUEST WIDESPREAD DISTRIBUTION

My article discusses that Katrina was an Inside Job just like 9/11 and, as such, is grounds for Impeachment. In it I also call for all concerned citizens to ensure that the Katrina Investigation Panel is not yet another 9/11 COVER-UP Commission Panel.

The article is listed near the top of the middle column at: http://www.sfbayview.com/ .
Please consider sending a thank you letter and supporting this publication if you appreciate their practice (quite rare in media) of reporting actual truth.

Purposeful genocide deserves impeachment

by Cathy Garger

Even if there were no phony, illegal, staged wars going on,
Even if the president had never authorized deadly weaponized uranium to be used in our guns and tanks,
Even if there was no Patriot Act denying Americans their freedom,
Even if there was nothing that would lead us to believe that 9/11 was the inside job many scholars now believe it was,

Continued: http://www.sfbayview.com/021506/purposefulgenocide021506.shtml

Also, check out my new weekly column, Against These Wars, at:
http://mytown.ca/garger/

Sign the 9/11 Treason Independent Prosecutor Act Petition:
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/736718529?ltl=1140268605

Scholars for 9/11 Truth:
http://www.scholarsfor911truth.org/

Cathy Garger
Maryland
savorsuccesslady@yahoo.com

The world can only be redeemed through action--movement -- motion. Uncoerced, unbribed and unbought, humanity will move toward the light.
Alice Hubbard's introduction to An American Bible (1912)

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing, reviews, & more on new and used cars.

[This message contained attachments]

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Message: 11
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 06:41:34 -0800 (PST)
From: Cathy Garger <savorsuccesslady@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Bloggers in Amsterdam

Dear Roy,

Nice hearing from you again. It encourages me greatly that you are taking up the role of 9/11 Truth Activist overseas!

Thanks so much, Roy, on behalf of us here (some of us stuck, LOL) in the States.

From everything I have read, it is apparently easier for Europeans to grasp the complicity of the US government's role in 9/11 because (a) many already think of our government as the "Evil Empire," that is clearly up to no good (Note: I was shocked to find out from someone I know who recently came back from abroad that other nations actually refer to the US as "The Empire"!) and (b) because they do not possess a personal sense of pride and love for America which prevents so many Americans from acknowledging 9/11 Truth due to the defense mechanism of denial of painful truths due to cognitive dissonance.

Although I do not know any of these bloggers personally, I would like to suggest an approach you might like to consider. As I see it, the formation of the group, Scholars for 9/11 Truth (of which I am proud to be an Associate Member) has, almost overnight, lent a tremendous amount of credibility resulting in a widespread, growing media exposure to the entire 9/11 Truth movement.

In addressing bloggers throughout the world, I might suggest that you share the following press release: EXPERTS CLAIM OFFICIAL 9/11 STORY IS A HOAX - Scholars for 9/11 Truth call for verification and publication by an international consortium. http://www.scholarsfor911truth.org/PressRelease30Jan2006.html

I would simply stand up and read a few excerpts from the website of this group of respected scholars and associates: http://www.scholarsfor911truth.org/ . I would also mention that a large and growing number of Americans are waking up to the truth about 9/11 as an Inside Job (as well as many other illegal activities at the hands of our government).

In addition you may want to tell them about Jon Leonard's ( http://www.waronfreedom.org/) press release about Monday's protest in NYC that is the brainchild of Greg Nixon from our own 911truthaction:
http://newjersey.indymedia.org/en/2006/02/9918.shtml .

Best of luck to you, Roy.

Cathy Garger
Maryland
PS - Still trying to educate Americans about this War On America. My recent works include an article at: http://www.sfbayview.com/021506/purposefulgenocide021506.shtml
and a new weekly column http://mytown.ca/garger/ .

Dear 9/11 truth people,
Democrats Abroad Netherlands, of which I am nominally a member but which
I don't support, screened "Walmart: The High Cost of Low Price" last night
in The Hague and I went over and watched it. After it was over, the current
chair of the group asked me if I was going to "the blogger event" in
Amsterdam on Saturday. I had no idea what she was talking about, and it
turned out the announcement on it had just been sent out earlier in the
evening, so I saw it when I got back to Rotterdam:

From: "Democrats Abroad NL" <robbie@democratsabroad.nl> To: <announce@democratsabroad.nl> Date: Fri, 17 Feb 2006 15:39:57 +0100 Subject: [Democrats NL] REMINDER: Bloggers in Amsterdam at the Treehouse tomorrow afternoon! Sender: announce-bounces@democratsabroad.nl
Bloggers in Amsterdam
Saturday, 18 February, 4:00 - 6:00PM (doors open at 3:30PM for voter registration) American Book Center Treehouse (Voetboogstraat 11, Amsterdam) Holland.com and Blogads are bringing 25 American bloggers to Amsterdam for the "Bloggers in Amsterdam" program. We're lucky enough to have gotten the chance to have four of the nation's premier political bloggers engage in a panel discussion about the American and international political blogospheres, ways in which both types of bloggers can support each other's efforts and other topics.
Attending will be:

Jeralyn Merritt of Talkleft.com
Ezra Klein
Lindsay Beyerstein of Majikthise
Amanda Marcotte of Pandagon
Martin Wisse of Progressive Gold to represent international bloggers

Admission to this event is free. Refreshments will be for sale. Non-members are encouraged to attend. Hope to see you there! Thanks go to Sandra Culley for helping us put this together. Brian Walsh Communications Co-chair Democrats Abroad Netherlands webmaster@democratsabroad.nl

Details of this blogging junket can be found on the Web, and a list of
the 26 bloggers being feted with free flights, five-star hotels, etc.
is at http://www.bloggersinamsterdam.com. The whole thing hit me as kind
of fishy, and I see it's being criticized simply from an ethical viewpoint.
I'll look at some more of these people's blogs tomorrow before going up
in the afternoon, but so far they all seem to be squinky-clean on 9/11,
electoral fraud and so forth.

I'm wondering if anyone is acquainted with any of these bloggers and
has any comments to offer about them. I would also appreciate any quick
advice on how I might best approach this event in the interest of 9/11
truth. I'm tending to doubt that they're all junior-CIA blogging agents
or anything - or maybe they are, what do I know? - but I have a feeling
I could surely handle this thing in a better or worse manner, so I'm
asking for advice and will appreciate any that any of you can whip off
here at the last minute.

Thanks,

Roy McCoy <roy@luna.nl>
Rotterdam, NL

The world can only be redeemed through action--movement -- motion. Uncoerced, unbribed and unbought, humanity will move toward the light.
Alice Hubbard's introduction to An American Bible (1912)

---------------------------------
Relax. Yahoo! Mail virus scanning helps detect nasty viruses!

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Message: 12
Date: Sat, 18 Feb 2006 10:43:53 EST
From: JKMarion@aol.com
Subject: re: Kick ass on Monday!

hiya

I wish I could be there on Monday at GZ but I can't- to all who do make
it- kick some ass! get assertive- know your rights and do not be afraid to
express that to the NYPD jerks- MAKE AN IMPACT- that is the battle cry this
year imop do what you have to do, nonviolently to MAKE AN IMPACT!
Don't get suck in by fomenter agents that crawl around NYC- they want to
cause trouble to distract and tear us down. Good luck Patriot Jim Kujawa of
Tampa fl

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Discussion about 09/11/2001

Saturday, February 18, 2006

[911TruthAction] Digest Number 1135

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