Thursday, June 22, 2006

1.: Re: U.S. Brigadier General Says Israel is the problem not Iraq -- h

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:48 pm (PST)

The spook agencies answer untimately to the money powers. Israel was created by the Rothchilds. Zionism is one of the elite's tools of causing war & terrorism, etc to further their sick agendas.

rriverrapid <rustrobert@hotmail.com> wrote: The world's problems are created by more than the "jews" of Israel.
Isreal has its Mossad, just like many other countries have their
secret agencies. CIA, MI-6, MI-5 CSIS, FBI, SDECE, SISMI, FSB(KGB),
BND, and fifty others. CIA is the largest by far, with the British
next. One must remember that it is the west, lead by English and US
interests, that created the new state of Israel after WWII for the
purposes of having influences in the middle east and a whole lot of
other secret reasons. Am I to believe that the Mossad, with its puny
budget compared to the CIA, somehow is directing the CIA and MI6,
those two benevolent, peace loving, altruistic organizations that
wouldn't slap at a mosquito cause t's "not nice to do", and
controlling all world affairs. It's Qui Bono? Is the US and Britain
conquering Iraq and the whole Middle East because Israel wants a
bigger slice of desert pie? Focusing on Israel for the worlds
problems is like focusing on Africans for making the problem of
slavery. Sure they're involved, but they're not all that causative
compared to the truly big players. To focus on Isreal as the source
of everyone's trouble is disingenuous, misleading, and dishonest, to
say the least. From that focus, I sense an interest in spreading
prejudice, black and white biased thinking, short judgement,
simplistic thinking, and otherwise dishonest and manipulative
agendized promotion of suspect beliefs.

Robert

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2.: 9/11 Naming Names! - Tonight, 8 pm ET

Posted by: "reggie501" reggie501@optonline.net reggie501

Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:56 pm (PST)

TVNL RADIO SHOW - http://tvnewslies.org/html/radio_show.html
8 pm ET

Thursday, June 22nd: 9/11 Naming Names! Some interesting information
has come our way regarding the people responsible for the events of
September 11th, 2001. TvNewsLIES.org will be hosting a guest who is
prepared to finally expose some of the people who made those events
possible. While we have not yet checked out all of the information
given to us the information that will be disclosed live on our show
will be at the very least verifiable. Once the names are out we can
start doing some real research related to the disclosure. This week's
program will prove to be very interesting!

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3a.: Re: Loose Change Nonsense

Posted by: "S Miles Lewis" yahoolists@elfis.net elfismiles

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:01 pm (PST)

<http://www.911research.com/reviews/loose_change/>

--- In 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com, Richard Pierce
<phobicflyonthewall@...> wrote:
>
> You should actually try to verify the info in "Loose Change." Even
most of what they showed, they gave the source.
>
> Your last sentence had a ring of truth to that I'm sure you didn't
intend. It really is sad how easily and mislead people have been with
the professional liars in govt.

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3b.: Re: Loose Change Nonsense

Posted by: "Nora Lenz" nmlenz@speakeasy.net rawnora

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:09 pm (PST)

Thanks, Scott, for that useful link. I hope some here will avail themselves of it.

I have a fairly large discussion list of my own (on a topic unrelated to 9/11) and this list makes me very thankful that I made the early decision to moderate it very tightly. As a result, people there are friendly and supportive of each other, they sign their posts with their real first names, they only ask questions if there is a sincere desire to understand, they don't take anonymous jabs at each other or resort to name-calling, sarcasm or triangulating or any of the other juvenile behaviors that I've seen on this list. Further, the purpose and mission of my list is not subject to the off-topic, pet issue-based whims of the posters. We stay on topic and we all learn and benefit from each other's knowledge. We don't waste our time squabbling over implied insults like when a person is intelligent and realizes it and has enough confidence to say so. Robert's obvious self-security isn't offensive to anyone except those who, by their own insecurities, put themselves beneath him. For my part, I've saved Robert's posts to compile and pass along to interested others. There is a great deal of rare and sensible wisdom and knowledge there, for those who are able to recognize it. I don't anticipate I'll be here much longer, so I'd like to end with a big 'thank you' to Robert for taking the time to share with us.
Best regards,
Nora

----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Peden
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:09 PM
Subject: RE: [911TruthAction] Loose Change Nonsense

I haven't read the rest of the days mail, but wouldn't an Ad Hominem attack be the next item in line, that is, attack the poster instead of dealing with the issue?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

I suppose I'll find out before the next 4 hours of doing mail is over...

Scott..

-----Original Message-----
From: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com [mailto:911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Ole Gerstrøm
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 1:25 AM
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [911TruthAction] Loose Change Nonsense

Dear Robert,

What are you up to?

You claim that "Loose Change is so full of nonsense."

But you do not document one error!

Yours, Ole Gerstrom

----- Original Message -----

From: rriverrapid

To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:16 AM

Subject: [911TruthAction] Loose Change Nonsense

The video Loose Change is so full of nonsense mixed with truth that
the person who made the video couldn't have done a better job at
creating and spreading misinformation and confusion had they been the
actual perpetrators following through with their cover up program.

Truthful discovery requires the revelation of the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth. Loose Change is a VERY deceptively
produced video. It's a video designed to entrap the gullible and
careless researchers and common people into making fabulous claims,
thus making the whole 911 discovery movement appear as a bunch of
misdirected space cases, endlessly pursuing embarassingly false
claims such as no planes hitting the Pentagon and more. There is a
lot of truthful information in the video, but its the volumes of
inaccurate and misleading claims that make the video worse than an
actual frontal assault on legitimate 911 researchers.

It's a shame how easily mislead individuals and masses in our culture
have become.

Robert

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4a.: Re: seen the photos -evidence of elements that do not incinerate int

Posted by: "mikemeyer1964" mike.meyer@asm.com mikemeyer1964

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:03 pm (PST)

It seems appropriate to repost an article I posted here a few weeks
back. While many have debated the plane, no plane, plane but no 757
theory, my write up below discusses certain damage that simply can
not be explained by a 757 impact. Read on, I would be extremely
interested if anyone can come up with a theory that explains the C-
Ring exit hole.

Mike Meyer

Pentagon C Ring Exit Hole Mystery

Detailed below is a revised write up [from "A Boeing 757 did not hit
the Pentagon"] regarding the unexplained Pentagon C-ring exit hole.
I have received valuable feedback on my previous write up, from many
911 researchers. I have included numerous clarifications and
details, and have directly addressed some of the main stream media
explanations regarding the C-Ring Exit Hole.

A great deal has been written about the damage to the Pentagon on
9/11. The focus of this discussion is on the mysterious, and
officially unexplained, "C-Ring Exit Hole". The C-ring exit hole is
significant because it is not consistent with building damage from a
Boeing 757 impact. The C-Ring exit hole carries a unique signature,
which can only be explained by something other than a 757 impact.
No explanation is offered for this hole in the Pentagon Building
Performance Report
http://fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/build03/PDF/b03017.pdf or the official
9-11 Commission Report.

The exterior C-ring wall is the last wall (the third wall traveling
into the Pentagon) that sustained significant damage during the
Pentagon attack. On 9/11, a near perfectly round, nine foot
diameter hole was cut in the C-Ring wall, known as the "C-Ring exit
hole". It is approximately 310 feet from the impact on the outer
Pentagon wall (E-ring). The unique feature of this hole include:
its circular shape, the clean cut hole in the wall with no visible
damage to the wall immediately surrounding the hole, and steel rebar
is cut by the forces which created the hole. For an overview of the
hole, see this page: http://www.pentagonresearch.com/exit.html

From the impact on the E-ring wall, to the C-ring Exit hole, is an
open office space with only support columns and ordinary
construction interior walls. According to the Building Performance
Report, there were intact (but damaged) support columns starting at
roughly 160 feet into the building in the aircraft flight path,
indicating that the fuselage of the aircraft had effectively been
destroyed by this point. The C-ring wall was constructed of steel
mesh and rebar reinforced brick, 8 inches thick. Details are shown
here. http://www.pentagonresearch.com/065.html

The initial explanation offered was that nose cone/fuselage of the
757 aircraft punched all the way from the E-ring wall, to the C-ring
wall, to create this exit hole, the "nose cone" theory.

The structural design of the 757 is based on the structural loads of
a pressurized vessel (the cabin), and the structural and aerodynamic
loads from the wings, control surfaces, and the fuel. The plane is
made as light as possible, and not made to handle impact loads of
any kind.

This "nose cone" theory was quickly discounted as there was no
significant aircraft wreckage found at the C-ring wall, nor would an
aircraft impact have cut a clean hole without disturbing any of the
surrounding wall. There were also support columns still standing in
the flight path of the aircraft.

Next, investigators from Purdue University proposed that fuel,
airplane material, and momentum from the aircraft created this
circular cut out by continuing into the building after the plane had
been destroyed. This "circle of energy" concept seems improbable
for a number of reasons:
1. The airplane materials included the plane and fuel in the
fuselage and wings. This material would have been spread out over a
non circular area which included the wings and fuselage.
2. There does not seem to be any historical precedent for this
phenomenon to have occurred.
3. There were support columns that remained standing in the path
between the impact point and the C-Ring exit hole that would have
deflected parts of this "circle of energy".
4. The impact of this material would have knocked the wall down, or
caved it in due to the mesh and rebar reinforcement, not created a
clean cut hole.
To have this material and energy "form up" into a circle so as to
cause this hole seems extremely unlikely. This "circle of energy"
theory seems to have also been discounted.

The National Geographic Channel aired a program "Seconds to
Disaster" which depicted the events at the Pentagon on 9/11. This
program aired most recently on May 24th 2006. They offered the
following explanation for the C-Ring exit hole: secondary explosions
from the impact and jet fuel, coupled with the geometry of the
inside of the impacted Pentagon, allowed shock waves to cause this
circular hole.

This "shock wave" concept also seems improbable for a number of
reasons:
1. The interior section of the Pentagon where the 757 impacted was
roughly 200 feet wide and deep with a significant hole from the 757
impact. Air is a compressible gas, and the forces required to knock
down a mesh and rebar reinforced wall are substantial. Shock waves
could certainly be present, but these shock waves would be in air,
and would be spread throughout the interior section of the
Pentagon. The hole in the C-Ring would require extremely localized
forces; to have these shock waves form a clean cut circular hole,
including cutting rebar, is extraordinarily remote.
2. Any forces impacting the wall from shock waves would be spread
over some area of the wall. These forces would knock the wall down
or crumple it if they were strong enough. These shock waves would
also be influenced and deflected by the support columns. Once
again, the clean cut hole defies the explanation of shock waves.
3. There does not seem to be any historical precedent for this to
occur, as there are routinely secondary explosions during fires, but
this clean cut circle phenomena has not been reported elsewhere.

Note: I asked to be put in contact with the authors of the "shock
wave" theory, but the National Geographic Channel merely directed me
to the Pentagon Building Performance Report and to Pentagon
reconstruction website as sources for the program. Neither of these
documents offers any explanation for the C-ring exit hole.

So what other possibilities could there be for a hole which has
these unique characteristics. I have previous with experience in
shape charge warheads, and anyone with this experience would
immediately recognize the hole to match that caused by a shaped
charge warhead or device.

The C-ring exit hole has these distinct features, which would have
occurred if this wall was struck by some sort of shaped charge:
1. The hole is circular as the typical shaped charge warhead is
round.
2. The hole is cleanly cut, in that the walls surrounding the hole
do not appear to have suffered any visible forces as would be
expected from the extremely localized and focused energy from the
shaped charge warhead.
3. Windows are broken outside of the C-ring exit hole. Shock waves
from the shaped charge high explosive are strong enough to break
typical glass (but not a reinforced brick wall).
4. The wall beyond the C-ring (towards the interior of the
Pentagon) is relatively undamaged, only some light charring. The
force of the shaped charge warhead is extremely localized and
focused and would have dissipated shortly after it breached the C-
Ring wall.

What is a shape charge? In simple terms it is high explosives
formed in a very specific geometry so that the explosive force is
extremely focused. Some good general information is located here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaped_charge . Look at the hole in
reinforced concrete hole here
http://www.raytheon.com/products/stellent/groups/public/documents/con
tent/cms04_011980.pdf
You can see how the wall is undamaged except for the hole; also note
how the rebar is cut.

Beyond the similarities in the hole shown in this brochure, are
there any other details about the Pentagon that raise more questions
about the hole in the C-ring wall, yes. On Russell Pickering's web
site www.pentagonresearch.com he has identified mistakes in the
classification of damage to the Pentagon near the C-Ring exit hole.
In summary, the Pentagon Building Performance Report indicates
gradual decreasing support column damage as you travel into the
pentagon along the flight path, to where there is limited damage by
the C-Ring exit hole, but this is incorrect, the column damage
increases again near the C-Ring Exit hole. This would be consistent
with a shape charge warhead detonating near or at the C-Ring exit
hole. See the detailed write up here.
http://www.pentagonresearch.com/094.html

Was the Pentagon Building Performance Report team allowed
uncontrolled access to the site? Not even close, access was limited
and they were escorted, see excerpts from the Pentagon Building
Performance Report here. http://www.pentagonresearch.com/bps.html
Note that the Building Performance Report team was not allowed to
see this exit hole, the FBI provided a photo and description. Why
would this team not be allowed uncontrolled access to assess
building damage? It should be noted that this team never saw any
damage to the Pentagon until all of the wreckage and debris were
removed.

So how did a shaped charged warhead get this far into the Pentagon?
One possible explanation is a multi stage shaped charge warhead
device. I do not propose that the following device was used at the
Pentagon, but one such multi stage device is described here.
http://www.llnl.gov/str/Coll.html
A page or so into this site describes "a weapon called a PAM, or
Penetration Augmented Munition". "Although compact and lightweight
(approximately 35 pounds, 33 inches long), it contains the power of
four explosive charges and when deployed, can effectively destroy
bridges, runways, roads, and tunnels". It describes a technology
where multiple shaped charges are used together, where the first
charge creates a hole for a second, and so forth. The successive
charges can be set off by separate sensors which detect the impact
with a wall. If you were to design a "bunker buster" warhead where
you had to penetrate multiple reinforced walls, this would be
technology to utilize, to allow you to penetrate further into a
multi walled structure than with a single shape charge warhead
alone. Due to the lack of walls between the exterior E-ring wall
and the C ring wall, it is likely that such a device would travel
until it hit a support column. Hitting a support column at an angle
could serve to deflect slightly the trajectory of the device.
Following this theory, the last charge struck the C-ring wall and
created the C-Ring exit hole. Having the device follow a deflect
path would also explain how there were still support columns in the
direct path of the aircraft to the C-Ring exit hole.

If something smaller than a 757 hit the Pentagon, a multi stage
shape charge may have been part of the payload to increase the
damage into the building, to better approximate the damage that
would be envisioned by a larger 757. A shaped charge warhead would
seem to be the only explanation that fits the evidence of a sudden
increase in damage to the Pentagon near the C-Ring exit hole and the
C-ring exit hole itself.

The only explanations offered by the "official" community,
the "circle of energy" and the "shock wave theory", have no
precedent, and violate some basic common sense and physics. My
proposal fits the classic shape charge damage seen from a typical
shaped charge warhead. The first time I saw the C-Ring exit hole, a
chill went down my spine because I knew that the only way to cut a
clean hole in a reinforced brick wall (including cutting through
rebar) is with a shaped charge warhead. With any type impact or
wave, forces would have caused the wall to crumble or cave in,
without cutting through rebar.

Many people have claimed that there is no evidence to doubt the
official version of events on 9/11. I guess that really depends on
your definition of evidence. With the C-Ring exit hole, we have a
hole that is clearly out of place with a 757 impact, we have
investigators that are not permitted to see the hole, and we have
damage near the hole not accurately presented in an official
report. What is your threshold for simply accepting a story from
the government?

The C-ring Exit hole is but one small chapter in the unexplained
events of 9/11. There are many other similar, unexplained events.
Isn't the fact that our Republic was forever altered by the events
on 9/11 require an investigation that puts to rest all of these
questions, no matter where it leads?

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4b.: Re: seen the photos -evidence of elements that do not incinerate int

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:23 pm (PST)

Did you see the videos of the airplanes hitting the twin towere??? Did you see the long holes left from the wings and the engines??? Now how come there was only a small-tiny hole right after the impact on the pentagon???

rriverrapid <rustrobert@hotmail.com> wrote: Judy,

Take a stroll through www.911review.com and 911research.com and you
will find pictures showing airplane debris all over the place at the
Pentagon, including engine structures, wheels, landing gear, and much
more. Study how a high speed plane hitting an immoveable object in a
head on manner at high speed breaks up into small pieces, or
disintegrates. Disintegrates doesn't mean turning completely and
entirely into gas. Don't fill your mind with visions of that.
Picture stronger plane parts breaking up considerably, but
lightweight material being turned into small pieces, like chuncks of
metal a pound to ten in weight. The crash scene reveals this in
pictures. We don't need to put claims in peoples mouths (such as the
governments mouth) that are not being made. Those folk in government
are people just like you and me. They don't have all the answers
either, they are not wizards who know everything about science and
technology, government workings, CIA operations, technical details on
plane crashes, and so forth. They do their job as best they can and
know how, just like any person at a factory who does his/her part in
screwing the bolt in place, but has no idea how to make a full car,
let alone run the factory that makes the car. To make a claim
that "government is lying to us" is to make a claim that everyone in
government is intimately involved in the cover up. This is
impossible. The only reasonable and rational conclusion is that rogue
elements within government and industry conspired to create 911, and
while everyone else just continued doing their jobs like they've
always done. This is not a black and white, government is evil,
people are good situation. It requires critical, careful
investigation and understanding. Imagine being that worker in a car
factory who desires to understand the entire workings of the factory
in order that they may design and fully operate another one. That is
essentially where the average person is regarding the 911 event's
occurence. Are you prepared to do the deep investigation that is
involved, and are you equipped or prepared intellectually to
accomplish the task?

We don't need to bring Eistein into 911. The pictures show all sorts
of easily seeable airplane debris all over the place at the Pentagon.
911 doesn't require quantum physics in order to understand what
happened, nor does 911 have to be made that complicated. The plane
did not disintegrate into gas and making that claim is ingenuous,
particularly in light of what the visual evidence clearly shows --
airplane debris all over the place, consistent with a high speed
airliner, a 757 specifically, hitting the highly reinforced, just
completed,bomb proof Pentagon exterior wall at a 45 degree angle,
creating a huge fuel explosion a second or two after the 757 started
disintegrating (breaking up extremely violently and thoroughly).

Robert

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5a.: Beware the 9/11 'Official Story': "You Have To Convince Yourself, By

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:38 pm (PST)

Beware the 9/11 'Official Story': "You Have To Convince Yourself, By Trying To Prove Us Wrong"

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5b.: Beware the 9/11 'Official Story': "You Have To Convince Yourself, By

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:53 pm (PST)

Beware the 9/11 'Official Story': "You Have To Convince Yourself, By Trying To Prove Us Wrong"

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6.: Fwd: [infowarsnews] Scientific Analysis Proves Towers Brought Down B

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:40 pm (PST)

Paul Joseph Watson <watson@prisonplanet.com> wrote:
Scientific Analysis Proves Towers Brought Down By Incendiaries
Steven Jones' analysis on WTC steel about to be released
Paul Joseph Watson/Prison Planet.com | June 20 2006
Scientific analysis on WTC steel debris undertaken by BYU Professor Steven Jones proves that the twin towers were demolished by means of incendiary devices and the release of the conclusive evidence is imminent.
The material that was first brought into question on the back of photos and video clips of the twin towers showing a dripping molten substance and floating white ash can now be confirmed as being thermate, combining thermite which is used as an incendiary device to bring down structures and sulfur, which cuts through steel quicker and leaves a yellow residue.
Pools of molten yellow metal were also found underneath both towers and Building 7 subsequent to the collapses.
"The evidence points directly to controlled demolition which means an inside job brought these World Trade Center buildings down," Jones told radio host Alex Jones in a video interview.
Jones says that, "using advanced techniques we're finding out what's in these samples - we're finding iron, sulphur, potassium and manganese - these are characteristic of a variation of thermite which is used to cut through steel very rapidly, it's called thermate."
"In order to have thermite in these buildings in this way, to help bring the buildings down, that means that thermite had to be planted in the buildings which of course implies directly and inside job - someone had to have access into the buildings," said Jones.
Jones' has conducted over 40 peer reviewed scientific studies two of which were published in Nature and Scientific American.

Prison Planet.tv members can click here to watch a clip of Professor Jones explaining his findings. Subscribe by clicking here.
This facet of the 9/11 truth movement was first brought to light during a November 2005 appearance on The Alex Jones Show by Brigham Young University physicist Professor Steven Jones. Jones said that white phosphorous wasn't powerful enough to cause the implosion but that thermite was the likely culprit. Alex Jones's 2005 release Martial Law 9/11 Rise of the Police State highlighted the physical evidence that the towers and Building 7 were brought down with incendiary devices.
Jones stated that thermite was a "clever" choice because its ingredients, aluminum and iron oxide do not require identifying tags by law, meaning they couldn't be traced back to their manufacturers.
Watch the following video and observe how thermite completely melts a car engine in a matter of seconds, without the addition of sulphur, and also completely resists neutralization by liquid nitrogen. Notice how the dripping substance is identical to that seen in the south tower video.
WATCH THE VIDEO The following video highlights the fact that steaming hot molten metal was still being found at the World Trade Center site six weeks after the attack.
WATCH THE VIDEO
Jones also, "cited video pictures showing white ash rising from the south tower near the dripping, liquefied metal. When thermite burns, Jones said, it releases aluminum-oxide ash. The presence of both yellow-white molten iron and aluminum oxide ash "are signature characteristics of a thermite reaction," he said."
American Free Press writer Christopher Bollyn discusses evidence of thermite used to sever the twin tower's steel support columns in the picture below.

"In this photo, for example, the column directly above the fireman's helmet shows that it was cut with thermite. There is a substantial amount of hardened molten iron which can be seen on both the inside and outside of the box column. This is precisely what one would expect to find on a column which had been cut with thermite," says Bollyn.
White flames consistent with how thermite reacts producing molten iron and aluminum oxide are also visible in this photograph at the corner of the 81st floor of the south tower.

The USGS Spectroscopy Lab produced images which showed dense thermal hot spots days and weeks after the attacks. ABC News reported that, "the temperature at the core of "the pile," is near 2000 degrees Fahrenheit, according to fire officials, who add that the fires are too deep for firefighters to get to."
The public release of Professor Jones' scientific analysis is imminent - watch this space for the story as soon as it breaks.
COMMENT ON THIS ARTICLE

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7a.: Re: Resistance in the US military to the Iraq war

Posted by: "Pay_the_Piper" pay_the_piper@shaw.ca

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:45 pm (PST)

Military resistance is a key factor in the current 9/11 conspiracy theory. If 9/11 was indeed a coup d'etat which put the USM under a foreign power and/or criminally illegal regime at the higher echelons, one might expect lower ranks to catch on and to stage a revolt obo their countrymen and constitution. It won't be the first time in world military history such a thing has happened. "You can fool some of the people some of the time but ...."

Until we get a good reason from the Pentagon for not presenting the autopsy/debris report from Flight 77, we must suspect something which multiplies the 9/11 horror 100x.

PtP
----- Original Message -----
From: Marsha MCClelland
To: wethepeople_united@yahoogroups.com ; TheRevolutionaryCoalition@yahoogroups.com ; CCCC-USA@yahoogroups.com ; ourrealnewsplace-owner@yahoogroups.com ; AwakenAmericanChristians@yahoogroups.com ; rcnewschat@yahoogroups.com ; FORUM_FOR_DISCLOSURES@yahoogroups.com ; catapultthepropaganda@yahoogroups.com ; apfn-1@yahoogroups.com ; Truth-or-Tradition@googlegroups.com ; campcaseyalumni@yahoogroups.com ; crawfordpeacehouse@yahoo.com ; reality101_redux@yahoogroups.ca ; 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com ; TruthAGAINSTtradition@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 11:53 AM
Subject: [911TruthAction] Resistance in the US military to the Iraq war

Resistance in the US military to the Iraq war

by Ann Wright US Army reserve Colonel (Ret) and former US Diplomat

As a 29 year Army and Army Reserves veteran, I am
horrified to see the politicalization of the U.S.
military under the Bush administration. The "ethics
and professionalism" of the U.S. military has been
targeted for destruction by the civilian appointees of
this administration. They want "yes" men and women
who do not question the legality of the policies of
the administration. Tragically, from the Chairman of
the Joint Chiefs on down, Rumsfeld and crew have been
successful in stifling professional discussion within
the military, with the exception of former Army Chief
of Staff Shinseki and now six retired generals.
Under the Bush administration, there is no
accountability or responsibility for criminal actions;
privates and sergeants are court-martialed, while
senior civilian and military leaders responsible for
the criminal policies are free.

Despite the "yes, sir" attitude of senior military
officers toward the Bush administration's illegal
policies, there is resistance within the U.S. military
to the war on Iraq. Military personnel know they have
the right and duty to refuse illegal orders, including
the order to deploy to an illegal war. They know the
United States executed German and Japanese military
officers and civilians for their participation in wars
of aggression in World War II. They know that the
Nuremberg principles adopted by the international
community after World War II require civilians and
military personnel to stop their government from
committing illegal acts. Those in the military who
dissent and resist to what they know are illegal
actions of the Bush administration are persons of the
highest courage and conscience.

Resistance to the war on Iraq within the U.S military
community is growing. Over eight thousand American
soldiers are absent without leave (AWOL), most living
underground in the United States. Many now refer to
AWOL as "Against War of Lies" instead of Absent
Without Leave. Individual non-public resistance in
the military generally results in an administrative
discharge without publicity. Thousands have turned
themselves into military authorities and have been
administratively discharged from the military. U.S.
military bases discharge dozens of war resisters each
week.

Public resistance by military personnel to the war on
Iraq results in courts-martial to make an example of
the resister. Some military personnel have applied
for conscience objector (CO) status. Most have been
denied CO status and ten have been court-martialed and
imprisoned for publicly refusing to obey orders to
deploy to Iraq to commit criminal acts in Iraq,
including murder by bombing innocent civilians,
shooting innocent civilians and torture. Those who
refuse to deploy to Iraq and kill for the Bush
administration generally receive more punishment than
those who commit criminal acts of murder and torture.

Four women who had served in the military were honored
last week at the annual War Resisters meeting in New
York City. Three had applied for conscience objector
status and had been refused by the military. One is
now imprisoned at Fort Lewis, WA for refusing weapons
training and deployment. One completed her assignment
in Iraq and returned to become a co-founder of Iraq
Veterans Against the War (IVAW).

Hundreds of U.S. military have chosen to resist the
war by living in Canada, most under the radar of the
now-conservative Canadian government. Twenty-four
U.S. military have publicly moved to Canada and are
seeking political refugee status. They are supported
by an incredible network of Canadians citizens and
American war resisters from the Vietnam era who are
now Canadian citizens, who assist the next generation
of U.S. military who resist illegal wars of
aggression.

This weekend Iraq Veterans Against the War, Veterans
for Peace and Gold Star Families for Peace, including
Cindy Sheehan and myself, participated in Buffalo, NY
fundraisers for U.S. war resisters living in Canada.
We met seven of the twenty-four brave men and their
families who have said the Bush administration's war
on Iraq is a war crime and their participation in the
war would mean that they too are war criminals. While
they are volunteers for the defense of our country,
they are not "yes" men to the administration; they are
"yes" men to the Constitution of the United States.
They are persons of conscience who see the war for
what it really is and are resisting the pressures to
dutifully comply to military orders to conduct illegal
actions.

Their decisions to live in Canada underscore the right
of military personnel to challenge an illegal order
and to live with the consequences of that challenge.
They have chosen live in Canada with their families
rather than being imprisoned for saying no to killing
for the Bush administration's goals. Should the
security of the United States truly be threatened,
they would defend it.

They live free of guilt of killing innocent Iraqis.
But the decision to live in Canada comes with its own
penalties. These brave soldiers and marines leave the
support network of friends and buddies in the
military. These persons of courage endure family
divisions when family members do not agree with their
decision to leave the military and go to Canada.
These honorable men undertake the daily struggles of
suddenly caring for one's family in a new country.
These honorable soldiers are unable to return to the
United States until an amnesty is offered by a future
President. But the consequences of the act of
conscience means these soldiers and marines will not
have the lifelong guilt of the murder innocent
civilians, nor the nightmares of seeing their friends
blown up in war whose purpose they believe is illegal
and a war crime.

This week Army First Lieutenant Ehren Watada will
become the first officer to refuse to deploy with his
unit to Iraq. He will be the first officer of this
war who refuses to participate in military actions
guaranteed to destroy his future emotional, if not
physical, life-and impact his family for decades to
come. This week also marks the first time in this war
that a church is offering sanctuary to war resisters.
The membership of First United Methodist Church of
Tacoma, Washington, just outside of Fort Lewis, where
Lieutenant Watada is stationed, has said that they
will resist the Bush administration's illegal war by
sheltering any who refuse to participate in the war.

Another aspect of resistance within the military
community comes from retired generals who are now
publicly questioning the military operational plans
that have put U.S. troops in jeopardy in Iraq and the
impact of the war on Iraq on the military and its
ability to respond to genuine threats to U.S. national
security.

For the twenty-nine years I was in the military either
on active duty or in the Reserves, my worst nightmare
was that an administration would get the United States
into a military conflict that I knew was illegal.
Today, if I were recalled from the U.S. Army's Retired
Ready Reserves, I would have to say, "I will not serve
the Bush Administration's war on Iraq. I will not
agree to be recalled. You will have to court-martial
me as I will not participate in this illegal war of
aggression, this war crime."

Acts of resistance, big and small, recognized
nationally or never heard by most, by military and
civilians are all important elements of ending the
illegal war, the war crime, committed by the Bush
administration. People of conscience all over the
country are refusing to be silent and are taking
courageous steps to end the illegal war on Iraq.

What will you do to stop this illegal war?

Ann Wright

Ann Wright is a retired Colonel with 29 years in the
U.S. Army and Army Reserves and as a U.S. diplomat for
16 years, and resisted the war on Iraq by resigning in
March, 2003 from her position as Deputy Chief of
Mission, or Deputy Ambassador from the U.S. Embassy in
Mongolia.

Ann served in the diplomatic corps in Nicaragua,
Grenada, Somalia, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Sierra
Leone, Micronesia and Mongolia and helped reopen the
U.S. Embassy in Kabul, Afghanistan in December, 2001.
As a U.S. military officer, she participated in
post-conflict reconstruction in Grenada, Panama and
Somalia. She received the State Department's Award
for Heroism as the acting U.S. Ambassador during the
evacuation of the international community during the
brutal rebel takeover of Freetown, Sierra Leone in
1997.

With her service in both the U.S. military and the
U.S. State Department in areas of conflict all over
the world, she felt the U.S. invasion and occupation
of an oil-rich, Moslem country that had done nothing
to the United States and was no threat to U.S.
national security would make the world more dangerous
and place the United States in greater jeopardy. She
believed the act of invading Iraq would be an act of
aggression, a war crime.

Two others from the U.S. diplomat corps also believed
the Bush administration's war on Iraq was illegal and
resisted by resigning from the U.S. government. As
civilian U.S. government employees, there was no
penalty to their resistance to the war except giving
up their careers.

Links:

GI Hotline www.girights.objector.org
War Resisters Support Campaign-Canada
www.warresister.ca.org
Peace Has No Borders www.peacehasnoborders.org
War Resisters League www.warresisters.org
Iraq Veterans Against the War www.ivaw.org
Veterans for Peace www.vfp.org
Gold Star Families for Peace www.gsfp.org
Military Families Speak Out www.mfso.org
The Real War Heroes
http://www.tomjoad.org/warheroes4.htm

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Messages in this topic (3)
7b.: Re: Resistance in the US military to the Iraq war

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:31 pm (PST)

dear Pied

Everythingk is connected to Everythingk (prolly not a good strategy/position for bringing about 9/11 accountability/clarity?)

if we pretend to focus only to obfuscate, then not only do we undermine confuse the Vital cognitive meme/tool, focus/'to focus'

we also simultaneously are not focusing

ifin ya knows whatta means?

Q;o)

----- Original Message -----
From: Pay_the_Piper
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Cc: defence@sen.parl.gc.ca ; espritdecorp@idirect.com ; information@forces.gc.ca ; cowan-j@rmc.ca ; day.s@parl.gc.ca ; oconnor.g@parl.gc.ca ; CANADIAN_CONSTITUTION@yahoogroups.ca ; LIBERTY-AND-JUSTICE@yahoogroups.com ; persians-jews-flies@yahoogroups.com ; U-S-A@yahoogroups.com ; Loges-de-Corbeaux@smartgroups.com ; bcpolitics@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 1:41 PM
Subject: Re: [911TruthAction] Resistance in the US military to the Iraq war

Military resistance is a key factor in the current 9/11 conspiracy theory. If 9/11 was indeed a coup d'etat which put the USM under a foreign power and/or criminally illegal regime at the higher echelons, one might expect lower ranks to catch on and to stage a revolt obo their countrymen and constitution. It won't be the first time in world military history such a thing has happened. "You can fool some of the people some of the time but ...."

Until we get a good reason from the Pentagon for not presenting the autopsy/debris report from Flight 77, we must suspect something which multiplies the 9/11 horror 100x.

PtP

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8a.: Re: "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with ra

Posted by: "Nora Lenz" nmlenz@speakeasy.net rawnora

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:00 pm (PST)

Leslie,
Your post is refreshingly calm and reasoned, and makes great sense. Thank you!
Nora

----- Original Message -----
From: Dick Eastman
To: lhs_emf@pacbell.net
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 11:22 PM
Subject: [911TruthAction] Re: "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred or you can ..."

From: Leslie Schwartz
To: 'Dick Eastman'
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:11 PM
Subject: RE: "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred or you can ..."

Dick;

Your assertions, your theory is just as I have characterized it.

As Webster Tarpley has said, 9/11 is synthetic terror and made in the USA.

Why do you see the Jews who are adherents to PNAC and not the non-Jews? Rumsfeld is not Jewish, neither is Cheney Jewish and these two characters are key players in the planning and execution of 9/11. Many of the PNAC authors were not Jewish (the majority are not Jewish) and had no meaningful personal ties to Israel for that to be their motivation.

As I have asked you now several times, look into the origins of the "government within the government" in the US. It started with people who covered up and hid Japanese and German war criminals in the interest of "national security". I am sure you know about operation "Paper Clip" and Reinhart Galen who fed incredible lies to the US administration and congress for decades blowing up the Soviet threat beyond all reason, and as a result grew their budget and rein of operations to that of a independent international nation wrecking and democracy wrecking overlord, and operated without oversight by congress or the American people.

These organizations have international reach and are connected to organized crime. In past decades they ran drug operations in Indo-China, Afghanistan, Columbia, etc. They set up death squads to move democratic governments into right wing dictatorships. They made deals with international corporations to exploit entire nations. They offer near unlimited wealth and power to clans like the Bush crime family who go along with the program. These people have no limits to their greed and murderous proclivities. Again, while these people have ties to organized criminal gangs which are based on nationality and ethnicity they are not "ideological" or race or ethnicity goal oriented. Its about the money and the power.

These people are so used to operating without restraint and passing along total fabrications without restraint that killing presidents and intervening in US politics has become just as routine as operating in and controlling the politics of third world, second world and European nations.

Creating a "new pearl-harbor" event is well within their means and their perceived self interest, given that its good for their business investments.

These people and interests I mentioned above are not identical with Bilderberg and the Rothchilds who do want a "new world order" and who have manipulated nations into war in order to profit. The interests of these two classes of international antagonists are not identical and while their program for the future may coincide at times but they also diverge significantly, as they do now diverge about Iran as you know from the recent Bilderberg meeting a week ago.

Yes, they are all pirates and bandits and war criminals and thieves and murderous, but they are not all identical and are not a singular entity in any way, and they sure as hell are not all Jewish.

It just doesn't have anything to do with race or nationality or religion and when you keep coming back to the same simplification it leads me to believe you have not taken the time to become familiar with the background information you need to make a contribution to understanding and exposing the 9/11 event and how these forces and interests operate in the US and in the rest of the world.

I don't know if in your heart you are a hater of other people based on race or ethnicity, but by your writings I would have to say you are obsessed with the same sort of distorted views about Jews, or Israelis, or Zionists, etc. (or other near synonyms by usage) that genuinely demented haters also exhibit.

Dick, it can't hurt you if you have the time and energy to read the two books I asked you to take a look at, widening your perspective may help you see all that you know now (and more) in more comprehensive way.

Leslie Schwartz
Dear Leslie,

I will look for the two books.

Thank you for the trouble you have taken in these three letters -- obviously of good will.

I cannot see how the evil major interests -- the big players -- could be so compartmentalized, so insulated from each other that the Zionist interests, the Israel Lobby, the Jewish dominated mainstream media could not be involved.

I have never said "all Jews" or "only Jews" nor have I meant "all Jews" or "only Jews" when I said that Jewish Zionist Neocons in the Defense Policy Board planned the needed New Pearl Harbor in order to realize their geopolitical designs. I know they are Zionists who planned 9-11 to serve their ends, but I must admit that I do not know their ultimate motivations, or the motivations of those they work for. Zionism, globalist one world, war profiteering, war loans, oil control, geopolitical positioning for the great game, Afganistan opium, or race hatred (if that is different from Zionism) -- but I do know that 9-11 could not have been carried off without the knowledge and cooperation of Mossad, CIA, the Pentagon, NSA and the White House
and other relevant organizations -- which points to the American power elite, especially the Zionist power elite interested in Israel's security and power.

I am not a political scientist or expert in foreign affairs -- I have concentrated on the solving of one crime. The perpetrators were Zionists and the fact is that only the cause of Zionism would afford the loyal network -- the fanatical trustworthiness needed to carry out 9-11. There simply are no other systems of close knit fanatics with the solidarity and the all-else-excluding-self-righteous moral (Zionist) focus to perpetrate this crime for their "higher cause" -- no other people could not be trusted to go through with such a crime merely for money or any other reason -- and I suppose that thinking such a thing makes me anti-Zionist -- a fact I have never tried to hide -- but let me repeat it: I do not blame "all Jews" or "only Jews" when I say only Zionist Jews could have pulled off this crime from inside the US government.

----------------------------------------------------------
From: Dick Eastman [mailto:olfriend@nwinfo.net]
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 8:52 PM
To: lhs_emf@pacbell.net
Subject: "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred or you can ..."

From: Leslie
To: 'Dick Eastman'
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:24 PM
Subject: RE: [911TruthAction] Re: U.S. Brigadier General Says Israel is the problem not Iraq -- here's why

The Bush crime family is growing more autonomous all the time.

It is simplistic to assert that because some people who support PNAC and who are involved with the Pentagon civilian leadership are Jewish that therefore 9/11 is a Jewish/Israeli/Mossad plot. Which is exactly the sum total of your obsession about the event. If that is your brilliant trail blazing then I stand in awe of your unique insight.

Also, the Saudi royal family is a product and creature of the CIA and of the Dulles brothers and all their milieu, including international crime.

Dick its up to you, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred, or you can actually start learning some facts that matter.

Loftus; "Secret War Against the Jews" Hopsicker "Welcome to Terror Land".

Leslie,

You are oversimplifying my deductions. The Pentagon leadership signed off on 9-11 -- they included Perle, Kissinger, Wolfowitz and other Neocon/Zionists -- these men are affiliated with Rockefellers and Rothschilds -- they work for the international investment banking interests. These banking families are committed Zionists -- they control Israel (Israel is not a true democracy) -- their interests are their own security as the haves against the have nots, Israel's security, geopolitical control of oil, and war profits, and the subjugation of the US in an authoritarian police state.

Organized crime -- including the world drug trade -- is tied to these ruling families -- organized crime -- and the banking families are at the apex of this criminal structure.

Razl Dazl and now Sean McBride! are saying I am blaming "all Jews -- which is certainly not true -- but I do point to the perpetrators of 9-11 who are Zionists and I do point to those Jews who knowing that 9-11 was a false-flag provocateur frame-up will go on the attack against the investigators calling them anti-Semitic and "against ALL Jews"

Are you doing the same thing yourself now? Accusing me of "racist ethnic hatred" is quite a blow to me -- I really don't know how to respond when it is thrown at me. I hoped people would see through razl dazl -- but now McBride has become "razl-dazl II" in his accusations.

Dick Eastman
Yakima, Washington
Every man is responsible to every other man.

http://bedoper.com/eastman
http://www.bedoper.com/eastman/witnesses/index.html
http://www.bedoper.com/eastman/small_plane/index.html
http://www.rinf.com/columnists/news/150-911-smoking-guns-found-in-the-mainstream-media
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman1.htm
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman2.htm
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman3.htm
http://judicial-inc.biz/Dov_zakheim.htm

----------------------------------------------------------

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Messages in this topic (6)
8b.: Re: "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with ra

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:10 pm (PST)

Me thinks that naveed & kevin are missing the point in most of eastman's posts. Eastman clearly differentiates between zionists & jews, like the in this paragraph taken from below.>> "Razl Dazl and now Sean McBride! are saying I am blaming "all Jews -- which is certainly not true -- but I do point to the perpetrators of 9-11 who are Zionists and I do point to those Jews who knowing that 9-11 was a false-flag provocateur frame-up will go on the attack against the investigators calling them anti-Semitic and "against ALL Jews"

Naveed <flanker12k@yahoo.com> wrote:
I second that motion, you must watch your use of terms mr. eastman
I have enough mail to read as it is. The LEAST you could do is condense it into one or two massive emails to help cut down on the traffic.

In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.
- Notebook, 1904

http://www.fightthenwo.org/

----- Original Message ----
From: Kevin Hammond <sir_oglaigh@yahoo.com>
To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 12:20:03 PM
Subject: Re: [911TruthAction] "Dick, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred or you can ..."

When you again FAIL REPEATEDLY to differentiate between Jews and zionists you cant blame them. If I see you say ""THE JEWS"" one more time I will have to moderate you. You absolutely MUST DO THIS ON THIS LIST! And why is it that you have not ONCE responded to a single ONE of my posts talking about the Masons? And please do not post so many of your debates on this group. It is wasting time and space.

Kevin

Dick Eastman <olfriend@nwinfo.net> wrote:
From: Leslie
To: 'Dick Eastman'
Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:24 PM
Subject: RE: [911TruthAction] Re: U.S. Brigadier General Says Israel is the problem not Iraq -- here's why

The Bush crime family is growing more autonomous all the time.

It is simplistic to assert that because some people who support PNAC and who are involved with the Pentagon civilian leadership are Jewish that therefore 9/11 is a Jewish/Israeli/Mossad plot. Which is exactly the sum total of your obsession about the event. If that is your brilliant trail blazing then I stand in awe of your unique insight.

Also, the Saudi royal family is a product and creature of the CIA and of the Dulles brothers and all their milieu, including international crime.

Dick its up to you, you can go on as a propagandist pleasing yourself with racist ethnic hatred, or you can actually start learning some facts that matter.

Loftus; "Secret War Against the Jews" Hopsicker "Welcome to Terror Land".

Leslie,

You are oversimplifying my deductions. The Pentagon leadership signed off on 9-11 -- they included Perle, Kissinger, Wolfowitz and other Neocon/Zionists -- these men are affiliated with Rockefellers and Rothschilds -- they work for the international investment banking interests. These banking families are committed Zionists -- they control Israel (Israel is not a true democracy) -- their interests are their own security as the haves against the have nots, Israel's security, geopolitical control of oil, and war profits, and the subjugation of the US in an authoritarian police state.

Organized crime -- including the world drug trade -- is tied to these ruling families -- organized crime -- and the banking families are at the apex of this criminal structure.

Razl Dazl and now Sean McBride! are saying I am blaming "all Jews -- which is certainly not true -- but I do point to the perpetrators of 9-11 who are Zionists and I do point to those Jews who knowing that 9-11 was a false-flag provocateur frame-up will go on the attack against the investigators calling them anti-Semitic and "against ALL Jews"

Are you doing the same thing yourself now? Accusing me of "racist ethnic hatred" is quite a blow to me -- I really don't know how to respond when it is thrown at me. I hoped people would see through razl dazl -- but now McBride has become "razl-dazl II" in his accusations.

Dick Eastman
Yakima, Washington
Every man is responsible to every other man.

http://bedoper.com/eastman
http://www.bedoper.com/eastman/witnesses/index.html
http://www.bedoper.com/eastman/small_plane/index.html
http://www.rinf.com/columnists/news/150-911-smoking-guns-found-in-the-mainstream-media
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman1.htm
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman2.htm
http://www.apfn.org/apfn/77_deastman3.htm
http://judicial-inc.biz/Dov_zakheim.htm

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9a.: "Jewish-generated hatred of Muslims"

Posted by: "jewish_from_brooklyn" jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com jewish_from_brooklyn

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:11 pm (PST)

< "Jewish-generated hatred of Muslims expressed through
< thousands of TV anchors into the minds of the populace got
< most of us to believe that Islamic terrorists ran planes into
< the Twin Towers. Five years later, there exists not a shred
< of evidence to prove this was so, except for what has been
< fabricated by the Israeli-controlled Pentagon."

http://www.warfolly.com/kaminski/themindlock-5.html

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9b.: Re: "Jewish-generated hatred of Muslims"

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:54 pm (PST)

what the fuck are you talking about?

i knew it was jihadists the moment i heard about it

On 6/21/06, jewish_from_brooklyn <jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> < "Jewish-generated hatred of Muslims expressed through
> < thousands of TV anchors into the minds of the populace got
> < most of us to believe that Islamic terrorists ran planes into
> < the Twin Towers. Five years later, there exists not a shred
> < of evidence to prove this was so, except for what has been
> < fabricated by the Israeli-controlled Pentagon."
>
> http://www.warfolly.com/kaminski/themindlock-5.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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10.: Re: Sean McBride wrote: Sometimes the charge of anti-Semitism isn't

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:15 pm (PST)

Could a Palestinian be called an antisemite? hardly. Unlike most Israelis, Palestinians are true semites themselves.

Dick Eastman <olfriend@nwinfo.net> wrote:

Sean McBride wrote:

Dick Eastman forwarded a post of mine from here to CTRL, without my permission and with the aim of stirring up a big ruckus there. In case anyone hasn't noticed yet, Eastman is a hardcore anti-Semite who regularly mixes together legitimate criticism of Israel with some of the most vicious Nazi-style assaults on Jews -- all the Jews. One cannot overstate how destructive his behavior is to the cause of trying to prevent a Mideast Armageddon. If I were Jewish, and saw his posts, I would probably end up on the extreme right of the Zionist political spectrum, just from an instinct for self-preservation. Sometimes the charge of anti-Semitism isn't a smear -- it's an objective statement of the truth. I don't think anti-Semites like Eastman should be censored, but they should be called out for what they are.

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11a.: Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to kill i

Posted by: "Bugs" brawny@twlakes.net brawny1946

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:21 pm (PST)

From: News.Desk@VHeadline.com
: Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to kill innocent people?

VHeadline.com Venezuela

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Wednesday, June 21, 2006

Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to kill innocent people?

VHeadline.com commentarist Mary MacElveen writes: I am literally sick to my stomach as I read Oscar Heck's piece in which he included on of the most damning video feeds coming from an Iraq War veteran named Jesse Macbeth.

I would link the video feed within my piece, but I want all our readers to go to Oscar's piece and hear his passionate words and take twenty minutes to listen to what this brave veteran has to say of the Iraq War.

Is twenty minutes too long to hear how you are being betrayed by your government if you are a citizen of the United States?

Is twenty minutes of your time so valuable that you will not listen just how we became the terrorists by occupying an innocent country?

http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=61744

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11b.: Re: Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to ki

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:51 pm (PST)

innocent people my fat ass

On 6/21/06, Bugs <brawny@twlakes.net> wrote:
>
> From: News.Desk@VHeadline.com
> : Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to kill
> innocent people?
>
>
>
> VHeadline.com Venezuela
> <http://www.vheadline.com/>
> http://www.vheadline.com
>
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> *TOP STORY AT THIS HOUR!*
>
> Wednesday, June 21, 2006
>
> Just how in hell can George Bush send soldiers off to Iraq to kill
> innocent people?
>
> <http://www.vheadline.com/macelveen/Mary_Bio.asp>VHeadline.comcommentarist Mary MacElveen writes: I am literally sick to my stomach as I
> read Oscar Heck's piece in which he included on of the most damning video
> feeds coming from an Iraq War veteran named Jesse Macbeth<http://vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=61615>.
>
>
> I would link the video feed within my piece, but I want all our readers to
> go to Oscar's piece and hear his passionate words and take twenty minutes to
> listen to what this brave veteran has to say of the Iraq War.
>
> Is twenty minutes too long to hear how you are being betrayed by your
> government if you are a citizen of the United States?
>
> Is twenty minutes of your time so valuable that you will not listen just
> how we became the terrorists by occupying an innocent country?
>
> http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=61744
>
>
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12.: Re: EXTRA EXTRA READ ALL ABOUT wingtv BLOWS THEIR COVER

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:14 pm (PST)

Just because you don't read??? I read it all!?!? And, I'm sure a bunch of others did too.

rriverrapid <rustrobert@hotmail.com> wrote: A shortened and well written summary is clearly required in
your "discussion". Otherwise, with no one bothering to read, you'll
only be wasting your own time writing.

Robert

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13.: For those that are confused with the Jewish/Zionist issue

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:30 pm (PST)

http://www.ziopedia.org/content/view/217/51/

There is no such thing as Antisemitism

Written by Andrew Winkler
Thursday, 01 June 2006
The whole concept of Antisemitism has always been a propaganda weapon used by Zionist activists to smear their POLITICAL enemies, implying that their attitudes towards them were motivated by racism. The closest thing to racially motivated hatred against Semites that is based on reality, and not mere propaganda fiction, is the day-to-day racism displayed by Zionists towards Palestinians for tbe past 60+ years.
Throughout history, negative feelings and actions against Jews have predominantly been motivated by religious zealotism or by resentment against their impact on the political, social, or economic customs and traditions of the community in which they settle. Even in Nazi Germany, ill feelings against Jews were almost exclusively motivated by the perceived responsability of Zionist Jews for Germany's loss of World War I and the fact that the vast majority of communists in both Germany and the Soviet Union were Jews, in other words purely political reasons.
Even the term 'Antisemitism' in non-sensical. More than 80% of today's Jews are Ashkenazi Jews , that is the descendants of Mongolian Turks. Their ancestors invaded Europe in the 7th century as part of Attila's hords and eventually settled under their Khazarian kings in the area of today's Russia and Ukraine and converted to Talmudism. They made a very good living out of controlling the lucrative trade on the ancient 'Silk Road' between China and Europe, until - in the 11th century - they had to take refuge in Central and Southern Europe from another wave of Mongolian invaders. In other words, the majority of today's Jews are not ethnic Semites.

---------------------------------

This article is featured on the encyclopedia section of Ziopedia
"http://www.ziopedia.org/components/com_mambowiki/index.php?title=Antisemitism"

---------------------------------
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14.: U.N. again urges Israel to cease targeted killings

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:33 pm (PST)

http://www.ziopedia.org/content/view/371/1/
U.N. again urges Israel to cease targeted killings Written by Irwin Arieff Thursday, 22 June 2006 UNITED NATIONS, June 21 (Reuters) - A senior U.N. official renewed a plea to Israel on Wednesday to cease targeted assassinations, citing a missile strike in Gaza that killed three children only a week after a similar deadly attack.

Thirteen Palestinian civilians, most of them children, have been killed by recent Israeli missiles aimed at rocket crews in Gaza.
Thirteen Palestinian civilians, most of them children, have been killed by recent Israeli missiles aimed at rocket crews in Gaza.

The latest such incident occurred on Wednesday, when a woman was killed and 13 other Palestinians were wounded in what appeared to be an Israeli strike against Gaza militants, witnesses said.

Palestinians have warned the attacks would fuel more violence but Israel defends them as necessary to end cross-border rocket salvos by Palestinian militants.

"We would like to once again underscore the need for Israel to cease targeted killings, which continue to claim civilian lives," Ibrahim Gambari, the U.N. undersecretary-general for political affairs, told the Security Council.

Secretary-General Kofi Annan was "particularly disturbed that despite his prior expressions of concern, this pattern was repeated yesterday, when three children were killed and a number of bystanders injured, during another attempted targeted killing by Israel, also in a crowded neighborhood in Gaza," Gambari said.

At the same time, the United Nations recorded 176 rockets fired by Palestinians from Gaza toward Israel during the past month, he said during the council's regular monthly briefing on Middle East developments.

While the Palestinian rocket firings caused no deaths, some hit Israeli towns and cities, injuring five civilians and damaging private property and government buildings including a school, he said.

Annan has repeatedly pressed the Palestinian Authority to act decisively against terrorism "including action to end indiscriminate rocket attacks that endanger Israeli civilian lives," he said.

At least 64 Palestinians have been killed, including at least 11 children, and at least 328 Palestinians have been injured during the past month, Gambari said. Forty-nine of those killed and 259 of the injured were victims of violence between Israelis and Palestinians while the rest were casualties of intra-Palestinian violence.

One Israeli was killed and 18 injured in Israeli-Palestinian violence during the same period, he said.

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15.: try to notice the superflous conflicts spammed & instigated across o

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:41 pm (PST)

see how hard the borg try to defend the continuation of the 'noise level' / needless confusion / cognitive dissonance (constantly neutering degree of awareness / clarity / human synergy focus / affect against the cancerous entropy usurping humanity)

while distracting, such simultaneously soils hope, ridicules to enlarge the feebleness rendering us docile onto the borg hive mind ... eclipsing our emancipation

Humanity's Battle, is precisely against such 'eclipsing'

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16.: Israel must have been involved (Re: "Jewish-generated hatred of Musl

Posted by: "jewish_from_brooklyn" jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com jewish_from_brooklyn

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:17 pm (PST)

Name Withheld <undisclosed@anonymous.com.> wrote:

> The hatred you must feel, I feel so sorry for you.

J_from_B responds :

Speaking of hatred ... it would constitute a serious oversight not to
consider the virulent newsmedia-induced hatred toward Arabs and
Muslims that was engendered by the 9-11 tragedy, and how this belief
continues to persist in the minds of many who continue to believe that
it was Arabs who attacked us on 9-11 when in fact there is no substantial
evidence in support of this notion.

> I know the truth, the truth is that the Israeli's had nothing
> to do with the attacks on 9/11

J_from_B responds :

Israel must have been involved, not necessarily because they had agents
who were seen dancing and "high-fiving" while the tragedy was unfolding,
but rather because we know that the US government was heavily infiltrated
by Israelis and Israel-firsters at the time.

Israel stood to gain the most from the tragedy and they were in a position
to carry out the disaster, and that makes them Suspect Number One in the
9-11 disaster investigation.

J_from_B.

> nor did President Bush, the blame
> lays solely on the backs of the "religion of Peace," masterminded by
> the leader Osama.

> Sorry, but maybe you should gear your hatred in the right direction.
> Instead
> of using a terrible event to propel your hatred towards a race of
> people.

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17.: Re: Psalm 18:37-44: "Kill your enemies" (King James Version)

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:49 pm (PST)

of all the things you have lost Eastman
its your brain you miss the most

On 6/21/06, Dick Eastman <olfriend@nwinfo.net> wrote:
>
> The hard 9-11 evidence convinces even the brainwashed -- that is why there
> is such an effort by the ruling criminals to prevent the brainwashed
> public
> from seeing this evidence -- from having it presented to them
> systematically.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Timothy-Allen Albertson
> To: 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [911TruthAction] Re: Psalm 18:37-44: "Kill your enemies"
> (King
> James Version)
>
> ....
>
> On 6/20/06, jewish_from_brooklyn <jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com> wrote:
> --- In 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com, "Timothy-Allen Albertson"
> <camotim@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > you think you are going to get me to
> > change my opinion by calling me
> > brainwashed
>
> It is extremely difficult to reverse the condition known as "brainwashing"
> once it has taken root. No amount of evidence will ever convince the
> brainwashed ... If people are led to believe that the moon is made of
> yellow
> styrofoam because that's what they were told on FOX News, the chances
> are slim that anyone will ever convince them otherwise.
>
> J_from_B.
>
>
>
>
> the best way in the
> > world is to piss me off is patronize me
> >
> > the enemies of Israel are the enemies
> > of the US about the only arab state
> > which can be trusted is Kuwait and
> > they'd kill a pallie faster than Israel
> >
> > btw, were your kin capos during the
> > holocaust?
> >
> >
> > On 6/20/06, jewish_from_brooklyn <jewish_from_brooklyn@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In 911TruthAction@yahoogroups.com, "Timothy-Allen Albertson"
> > > <camotim@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > and that is what USCENTCOM is doing
> > > > in its AOR to the enemies of the US
> > >
> > > The enemies of Israel are not necessarily the enemies of the US.
> > >
> > > The Arabs are getting mass-murdered because they are the enemies of
> > > Israel.
> > >
> > > People believe that Arabs are the enemies of the US because that's
> what
> > > they've been brainwashed into believing.
> > >
> > > J_from_B.
> > >
> > > > On 6/20/06, jewish_from_brooklyn <jewish_from_brooklyn@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I have pursued mine enemies, and overtaken them: neither did I
> turn
> > > > > again till they were consumed.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have wounded them that they were not able to rise: they are
> fallen
> > > under
> > > > > my feet.
> > > > >
> > > > > For thou hast girded me with strength unto the battle: thou hast
> > > subdued
> > > > > under me those that rose up against me.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thou hast also given me the necks of mine enemies; that I might
> > > destroy
> > > > > them that hate me.
> > > > >
> > > > > They cried, but there was none to save them: even unto the LORD,
> but
> > > > > he answered them not.
> > > > >
> > > > > Then did I beat them small as the dust before the wind: I did cast
> > > them
> > > > > out as the dirt in the streets.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thou hast delivered me from the strivings of the people; and thou
> > > > > hast
> > > > > made me the head of the heathen: a people whom I have not known
> > > > > shall
> > > > > serve me.
> > > > >
> > > > > As soon as they hear of me, they shall obey me: the strangers
> shall
> > > submit
> > > > > themselves unto me.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.1/369 - Release Date: 6/19/2006
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.1/369 - Release Date: 6/19/2006
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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18.: 9/11 news update 6/21

Posted by: "reggie501" reggie501@optonline.net reggie501

Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:25 pm (PST)

Correction: 9/11 discussion on TVNL RADIO is THURDSAY, 6/22

9/11 News : http://www.tvnewslies.org/news/#911

· 9/11 Vendetta - A 9/11 Truth video, drawing parallels to the
movie "V for Vendetta".
· Academics give a scholarly stamp to 9/11 conspiracy theories - By
many accounts, scholarly contributions to the movement began with Mr.
Griffin, who retired from the Claremont School of Theology in 2004.
About a year and a half after September 11, Mr. Griffin began reading
books and Web sites arguing that the U.S. government was complicit in
the attacks. Eventually, they won him over.
· al-Qaida Video Shows Alleged 20th Hijacker - Al-Qaida has identified
a would-be 20th hijacker for the Sept. 11 attacks as a Saudi operative
who was killed in a 2004 shootout with his country's security forces.
TVNL Comment: How many 20th hijackers have we been told about so far?
· Saudis Offered Scholarships for Aviation Courses in US - The
Ministry of Higher Education and the General Authority of Civil
Aviation are offering scholarships to Saudi men and women to study
various majors related to civil aviation in the United States.

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Thursday, June 22, 2006

[911TruthAction] Digest Number 1346

Messages In This Digest (25 Messages)

Messages

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:48 pm (PST)

Posted by: "reggie501" reggie501@optonline.net reggie501

Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:56 pm (PST)

Posted by: "S Miles Lewis" yahoolists@elfis.net elfismiles

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:01 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Nora Lenz" nmlenz@speakeasy.net rawnora

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:09 pm (PST)

Posted by: "mikemeyer1964" mike.meyer@asm.com mikemeyer1964

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:03 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:23 pm (PST)

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:38 pm (PST)

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:53 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:40 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Pay_the_Piper" pay_the_piper@shaw.ca

Wed Jun 21, 2006 1:45 pm (PST)

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:31 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Nora Lenz" nmlenz@speakeasy.net rawnora

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:00 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:10 pm (PST)

Posted by: "jewish_from_brooklyn" jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com jewish_from_brooklyn

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:11 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:54 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:15 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Bugs" brawny@twlakes.net brawny1946

Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:21 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:51 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:14 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:30 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Richard Pierce" phobicflyonthewall@yahoo.com phobicflyonthewall

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:33 pm (PST)

Posted by: "smacko" smacko9@comcast.net drsmacko

Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:41 pm (PST)

Posted by: "jewish_from_brooklyn" jewish_from_brooklyn@yahoo.com jewish_from_brooklyn

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:17 pm (PST)

Posted by: "Timothy-Allen Albertson" camotim@gmail.com

Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:49 pm (PST)

Posted by: "reggie501" reggie501@optonline.net reggie501

Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:25 pm (PST)

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